Turkey

I wish I suggested this great exchange that I had with Jan which dates back to last September (I should have done that with several former comments):

“jan

Comment by jan | 2011/09/25 at 02:01:27

Turkey should not join the EU at all because there is no benefit whatsoever towards Turkey other than lifting visa requirements to visit Europe. As for economy gain, there’s no such gain because once Turkey joined, it will be used to the ground because it looks as if Turkey is so desperate to do and give anything which the EU demand like being held on a rope. They will never see Turkey as one of them or equal because regardless to them it will always be a Muslim country or exucse wise huge population compared to others which threaten them. Turkey should just maintain business relations rather than being one of them. For economy gain, there are many ways for Turkey to have a stronger economy or bring more businesses into its country. Turkey does not have weak currency, or going into crisis like Greece or any of the European countries.
If Turkey is able to change, why it NEEDS to join EU in order to change? Why have your country to be run by someone else or constantly having people to tell you what to do in order to be one of them. Turkey do not need EU, it is the other way round! Why sell yourself short? In the process of joining EU, Turkey has prove itself to the WORLD not just EU that it is not like any of the Muslim country. It is a democratic country and everyone has the right to vote including women. Being able to NOT run it’s country using religion, unlike some countries, I think that says alot about Turkey. It has full credit of being a country that sets full example to the rest of the world. I hope Turkey government is able to re-consider their decision.”

“Cem

Comment by Cem | 2011/09/25 at 12:40:43

Hello jan,

I quote you:

Turkey should not join the EU at all because there is no benefit whatsoever towards Turkey other than lifting visa requirements to visit Europe.

Very well said. Very well said!

Many say that Turkey’s first trading partner is the EU hence it has to be an EU member.

Well Turkey is not currently an EU member but that doesn’t prevent it from trading with the EU. Anyway, in the first instance the world economy is shifting to Asia. In the second instance, the EU population is ageing.

As for economy gain, there’s no such gain because once Turkey joined, it will be used to the ground because it looks as if Turkey is so desperate to do and give anything which the EU demand like being held on a rope.

The EU is exactly doing that regarding the chapter on competition of the EU-Turkey negotiations. Zafer Çağlayan denounced that a few months ago (http://turkey.blogactiv.eu/2011/05/16/zafer-caglayan-ab-bilirsiniz-son-derece-riyakar-ve-iki-yuzlu-bir-yapiya-sahiptir/ (Article in Turkish, but it’s worth seeing the caricature of the current EU!)) and said that the EU is hypocritical and that Turkey will not obey the EU blindly. In fact, he stated that the EU blocks almost all the chapters but absolutely wants to open the chapter on competition. The EU is behaving like a carpet dealer.

They will never see Turkey as one of them or equal because regardless to them it will always be a Muslim country or exucse wise huge population compared to others which threaten them.

I think that once (Turkey) an EU member the situation will dramatically change. Turkey will improve the EU parliament.

Turkey should just maintain business relations rather than being one of them.

I believe that thanks to Turkey’s EU membership the EU will at last become the blacksmith of the peace in the globe. That is the only reason for which I do support Turkey’s EU memberhsip. Really. Turkey’s EU membership will be a strong political and cultural tool that will help humanity.

Turkey will take advantage of the EU funds but it will also be a huge contributor to the EU budget. Turkey will become a very rich country. And according to the excellent Kemal Derviş, Turkey will be rich earlier than expected.

I support Turkey’s EU membership, but owing to the disgusting racism, double standards and blatant treacherousness of the EU, I want Turkey not to receive the EU funds but at the same time not to contribute to the EU budget. That is my wish as a Turkish citizen whose heart is broken.

For economy gain, there are many ways for Turkey to have a stronger economy or bring more businesses into its country. Turkey does not have weak currency, or going into crisis like Greece or any of the European countries.

A British insitution said a few months ago (I don’t remember which one, I should have kept the link) that the EU is jealous of the economic performance of Turkey.

If Turkey is able to change, why it NEEDS to join EU in order to change?

You’re right, nowadays Turkey doesn’t need to join the EU to change. Notwithstanding, with regard to several chapters such as environment or food saftey, the negotiations process (not the EU membership) is vital.

Why have your country to be run by someone else or constantly having people to tell you what to do in order to be one of them. Turkey do not need EU, it is the other way round!

In fact, the politicians Olli Rehn, Günter Verheugen and Jack Straw underlined that too. The English economist Roger Bootle also stated that. Lastly, Uli Dönch, a German journalist, wrote that too on September 22nd 2011: I quote Turkish newspaper Dünya English that refered to the article published by Focus magazine:

Stating that Europe, consisting of an old population, needs Turkey more than Turkey needs Europe, Dönch indicated that Turkey enjoys great economic data, educated and hard-working young population. He added that the rapidly growing and improving Turkey wouldn’t wait in front of Europe’s door for a long time and suggested that Europe becomes Turkey’s partner, instead of being a slave to Greece.

I quote you dear jan:

Why sell yourself short? In the process of joining EU, Turkey has prove itself to the WORLD not just EU that it is not like any of the Muslim country. It is a democratic country and everyone has the right to vote including women. Being able to NOT run it’s country using religion, unlike some countries, I think that says alot about Turkey.

Thank you very much.

The Turkish women had the right to vote well before the French and Suiss women.

There are only 3 secular countries in Europe: France, Portugal and Turkey. Surprising but true!

It has full credit of being a country that sets full example to the rest of the world. I hope Turkey government is able to re-consider their decision.

Dear jan, a referendum will be held in Turkey at the end of the EU-Turkey negotiations. Turkey’s EU membership is strategic for the Turkish leaders. But the Turkish citizens may vote “No” through the referendum. And you introduced the reasons of that “No” through your comment my friend.

Yours sincerely,

Cem”

I also like Civitas’ comment that brightened the horizon.

Yours faithfully,

Cem

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Comments

  1. Hi Cem

    Good on you my friend still flogging the donkey I see!

    We are agreed then, Turkey does not need to join the EU.

    On the other hand if they do want to join (I think you secretly hope for that) then all
    they need to do is sort out the ‘human rights’ problem and the ‘censorship of the internet’
    by their citizens.

    Good Luck and Regards

    George Mc

  2. Dear George,

    is it a joke or are you really in the fog?

    I don’t secretly hope for Turkey’s EU membership.

    Isn’t it crystal clear that I have been openly supporting it since 2009 through BlogActiv?

    If you are not joking, I think that you hastily commented that current post.

    You have to read again that post.

    I remind you an extract if you forgot your glasses!

    >> I believe that thanks to Turkey’s EU membership the EU will at last become the blacksmith of the peace in the globe. That is the only reason for which I do support Turkey’s EU memberhsip. Really. Turkey’s EU membership will be a strong political and cultural tool that will help humanity.

    “The blacksmith of the peace in the world”. Very good, isn’t it?

    And here is a former article in which you can see again that I am a strong supporter of Turkey’s EU membership:

    http://turkey.blogactiv.eu/2010/10/25/a-message-to-the-eu-you-do-not-deserve-turkey-but-the-world-does-need-an-eu-member-turkey/

    I hope that you will understand now why Turkey’s EU membership is vital for the planet.

    Yours faithfully,

    Cem

    PS. Turkey is improving in every area.

    For instance Turkey resolved the Kurdish issue (you can read some articles of mine about that).

    Turkey has still many things to do, but don’t worry George, the EU commission and the EU are far from opening widely the door to Turkey. And that’s an euphemism.

    Last but not least George, Turkey is improving its Human rights for itself, not for the EU. That was highlighted several times by the Turkish leaders.

    Kurdish lessons at universities as well as a Kurdish TV channel were created for the Kurdish-rooted citizens, not to impress the EU.

    Turkey is changing because there has been a crucial political stability for 10 years, not because of the EU.

    PPS. Do you really care of the Human rights in Turkey or do you point your finger at them in order to stress your possible objection to Turkey’s EU membership?

  3. George Mc, a very simple question for you:

    If the EU picture that has been painted by EU politicians for you, is so concerned with the human rights in its member states, can you explain to us, how Latvia could become a member state while its Russian minority did not have electoral rights?

    Whenever there is a discussion about Turkey’s membership, never goes without a reference to its history in human rights and freedom. The picture that is painted for you is an illusion that disguises a greater hypocricy. Enlighten up!

  4. The undeclared potential risk for Turkey would be the threat posed to bugging Turkish Industries by an invasion of EU companies similar to what has been taking place in Romania! The Turks managed to become the World’s 16th biggest economy in terms of GDP based on Purchasing Power PArity and currently the Turkish Economy enjoys the second fastest developing GDP in the World. As it is expected that the rapidly ageing “geriatric Europe’ is likely to become irrelevant within the next twenty years as the economic center of gravity keeps shifting Eastwardly in the direction of the likes of China and India Turkey would be signing up for a gang of ‘soon to be losers’ as the declining birth rate is slowly imploding the EU while the young dynamic Turkey with an average age of 28.7 has nothing but promise of a bright economic horizon ahead!

    Currently as evidenced by the Chauvenistic Racist nations like France and Germany the only appreciable product of ‘Old Europe’ appears to be hateful, crusader literature. It is almost certain the old Europe is gradually to turn into a black hole as what happens when a star implodes. No need for Turkey destined to be a top ten economy in the next 20 years to suffer the same fate!

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